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November 24th, 2008

There were some comments on a previous post BUY Misoprostol ONLINE WITHOUT PRESCRIPTION, about how the problem described in that post is somehow typical for applications that use ORMs. Buy cheap Misoprostol, I really could not disagree more.

It seems that even today, Misoprostol over the counter, Where can i buy cheapest Misoprostol online, in 2008 mind you, we still have a lot of people who are convinced that ORM usage can never be as efficient as the more classic data access approaches, buying Misoprostol online over the counter. Order Misoprostol from United States pharmacy, Now, i don't even want to get into the whole debate about where business logic belongs (but if you think it belongs in the database you no doubt have better things to do than reading this blog), where to buy Misoprostol, Misoprostol price, coupon, but one thing that does bother me tremendously is that a lot of people discard ORMs because they simply don't know how to use it properly.

An ORM is a tool, buy generic Misoprostol. Nothing more, nothing less, BUY Misoprostol ONLINE WITHOUT PRESCRIPTION. Order Misoprostol no prescription, Well, it is a pretty powerful tool and, rx free Misoprostol, Comprar en línea Misoprostol, comprar Misoprostol baratos, as with any other powerful tool, improper usage of said tool can really cause a lot of problems, buy Misoprostol without prescription. Misoprostol from canadian pharmacy, Should we discard the tool because a lot of people never took the time to figure out how to use it properly. That would be kinda stupid, buy Misoprostol online cod, Australia, uk, us, usa, no.

It seems to me that a lot of people seem to have this misconception that using an ORM essentially leads to data-fetching in tremendously inefficient manners, where can i order Misoprostol without prescription. BUY Misoprostol ONLINE WITHOUT PRESCRIPTION, They see the tutorials where only the 'get-by-id' functionality and the lazy loading features are shown and they somehow think that's all there is to it. Purchase Misoprostol online, They hear all the horror stories about projects that performed terribly because the developers used an ORM and they blame the tool, not the developers, Misoprostol samples. Misoprostol gel, ointment, cream, pill, spray, continuous-release, extended-release, Nevermind the fact that there are plenty of projects that use more classic data access approaches who perform like shit as well.

So let's try to get a few of these misconceptions out of the way, buy Misoprostol ONLINE WITHOUT prescription, Buy Misoprostol from mexico, shall we.


  • You can create highly efficient queries with an ORM tool, ordering Misoprostol online, Order Misoprostol online c.o.d, and you can actually do so in a manner which enables high developer productivity

  • ORM's are not slow by definition. Using them wrong (just like with any other data access technology) can be tremendously slow however, BUY Misoprostol ONLINE WITHOUT PRESCRIPTION. Who's at fault?

  • ORM's do not use a shitload of memory, buy cheap Misoprostol no rx. Order Misoprostol from mexican pharmacy, Improper usage of them however can lead to excessive memory usage. Blame the developer, order Misoprostol online overnight delivery no prescription, Japan, craiglist, ebay, overseas, paypal, not the tool.

  • ORM's do not lead to lazy developers, who are doing lazy coding by relying on lazy loading, Misoprostol from canadian pharmacy. Rx free Misoprostol, Bad developers lead to lazy coding by relying on lazy loading.

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  • Xeno

    Seriously, it’s an MVC framework. We don’t take these moves slightly. It’s a complete rethinking of the framework and ORM maes it EASY for people to handle databases. That’s a big plus.

    However, there is always an engineering tradeoff; you cant make something easier to use without adding bloat. Ruby found that out when people kept saying that it doesn’t scale and CTO’s started dumping it. ORM is also problematic in the same way.

    Does this mean it is not useful? No. For small and medium projects that do not expect large amounts of growth and don’t have a DBA or other development resources, this may be ideal. But for those who do have a DBA who can tweak the queries for speed and scalability and if you do plan your website for growth, you should be ditching ORM and be building an SQL layer as you will be hand coding everything anyway.

    Friends of mine who work for AT&T who went with ORM for one of their apps ended up hand coding ALL their queries and I asked ‘so what is the point of ORM then’ and they said ‘basically none’. They could have done this with a sql layer just as easily and actually saved ALOT of time.

  • Xeno

    I understand your skepticism, after all you are a true believer and probably haven’t had to scale a 10 terabyte database yet for over 1 million daily customers. I don’t expect you to believe I have read and tried this with my team after all you believe whole heartedly that this stuff works.

    But having tested this and benchmarked it with hibernate, I can tell you it is indeed slower.

    You can blame it on developers all you want. You can sit here and say everyone else is wrong. You can tell me as the maintainer of an MVC framework that I am wrong as well. But it won’t stop people from saying it. And at some point, you may just do your own benchmarks against a sql layer… and you may find the same exact thing.

    I guess trying to talk anymore on this would be like Jesus trying to convince the Pope that he’s an athiest.

  • http://elegantcode.com Davy Brion

    regardless of the whole ORM vs SQL layer debate which we obviously can’t agree on, could you please point out what exactly an MVC architecture has to do with an ORM? They are in no way related, other than the fact that many people use them together… there is nothing in MVC which implies usage of an ORM.

  • http://elegantcode.com Davy Brion

    Btw, the reason i’m asking is because you seem to be throwing your MVC credentials around to prove your point, whereas i’m just wondering what on earth that has to with the ORM discussion :)